並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/sg/podcast/ep-176-%E9%95%B7%E5%8B%9D%E5%BF%83%E6%85%8B-%E8%AE%80%E5%BE%8C%E5%BF%83%E5%BE%97-%E4%B8%89%E5%80%8B%E9%A1%9B%E8%A6%86%E5%82%B3%E7%B5%B1%E8%BC%B8%E8%B4%8F%E7%9A%84%E9%97%9C%E9%8D%B5%E8%A1%8C%E5%8B%95/id1532820533?i=1000568276147