並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/%E8%81%B0%E6%98%8E%E6%85%A2%E8%80%81ep-15-%E8%B5%B0%E8%B7%AF-%E5%91%BC%E5%90%B8-%E8%88%87%E8%87%AA%E5%B7%B1%E8%AA%AA%E8%A9%B1-%E5%A6%82%E4%BD%95%E7%B7%B4%E7%BF%92%E9%99%AA%E4%BC%B4%E8%87%AA%E5%B7%B1-%E9%9D%A2%E5%B0%8D%E4%B8%AD%E5%B9%B4%E5%9B%B0%E5%A2%83/id1486227803?i=1000547315240