並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/tw/podcast/ep63-%E9%97%9C%E7%BE%BD%E5%92%8C%E5%BC%B5%E9%A3%9B%E7%82%BA%E4%BD%95%E5%9C%A8%E5%8F%B2%E5%AF%A6%E4%B8%8A%E8%A2%AB%E7%A8%B1%E4%BD%9C%E8%90%AC%E4%BA%BA%E6%95%B5-%E7%BF%BB%E9%96%8B%E5%85%A8%E4%B8%89%E5%9C%8B-%E5%8F%AA%E6%9C%89%E4%BB%96%E5%80%86%E5%BE%97%E5%88%B0%E9%80%99%E5%80%8B%E9%80%86%E5%A4%A9%E7%9A%84%E5%B0%81%E8%99%9F/id1533271443?i=1000524501263