並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-08-%E9%BB%9B%E5%A6%83-%E4%BA%BA%E6%B0%91%E7%9A%84%E7%8E%8B%E5%A6%83-%E5%AA%92%E9%AB%94%E5%AF%B5%E5%85%92-%E6%99%82%E5%B0%9A%E8%B6%85%E7%B4%9A-icon/id1536309307?i=1000501164149