並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-15-%E6%84%9F%E6%9F%93%E7%A7%91%E6%98%AF%E5%81%9A%E4%BB%80%E9%BA%BC%E7%9A%84-%E7%96%AB%E8%8B%97%E7%82%BA%E4%BB%80%E9%BA%BC%E8%A6%81%E6%89%93%E5%85%A9%E5%8A%91-%E5%B0%88%E8%A8%AA-%E5%8F%B0%E5%A4%A7%E6%84%9F%E6%9F%93%E7%A7%91%E4%B8%BB%E6%B2%BB%E9%86%AB%E5%B8%AB-x-%E6%84%9B%E6%BB%8B%E7%97%85%E5%8D%94%E6%9C%83%E7%90%86%E4%BA%8B%E9%95%B7-%E6%B4%AA%E5%81%A5%E6%B8%85%E9%86%AB%E5%B8%AB/id1559498064?i=1000529874947