並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep-47-%E4%BA%BA%E9%A1%9E%E5%9C%96x%E8%81%B7%E5%A0%B4-%E5%89%B5%E6%96%B0%E6%80%9D%E7%B6%AD/id1547609417?i=1000543319712