並前往https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ep95-%E6%B2%92%E6%9C%89%E8%B4%8F%E5%AE%B6%E7%9A%84%E6%B0%B8%E6%81%86%E7%AB%B6%E8%B3%BD-%E7%84%A1%E9%99%90%E8%B3%BD%E5%B1%80-%E6%80%9D%E7%B6%AD%E6%89%BE%E5%9B%9E%E5%B4%87%E9%AB%98%E4%BF%A1%E5%BF%B5/id1529301405?i=1000557454258