並前往https://www.listennotes.com/podcasts/%E8%89%BE%E8%8E%89%E5%A9%AD%E5%B9%B8%E7%A6%8F%E5%AF%86%E7%A2%BC%E5%BF%83%E7%90%86%E5%AD%B8/%E5%B9%B8%E7%A6%8F%E5%AF%86%E7%A2%BC%E8%AB%AE%E8%A9%A2%E5%AE%A4-10%E6%9C%8821%E6%97%A5%E4%B8%8B%E5%8D%88%E5%A0%B4-vFlzAVeO8d1/